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Si può fare un buon mmo basandolo sulla licenza di Matrix '
Cita da Hagakure193c su 31 Gennaio 2006, 10:36Su Mmorole-playerg.com è apparso un interessante dibattito sullo sviluppo e l'acquisizione di licenze per i giochi di ruolo massivi più diffusi. Se conoscete bene l'inglese si tratta di una discussione molto interessante sui risvolti economici e creativi che coinvolgono gli sviluppatori nel momento in cui pianificano la struttura di un MMORPG basato su un marchio di fama mondiale.
In particolare si parla e si cerca di anallizzare il fenomeno delle licenze, come tutti sappiamo negli ultimi anni e in particolare negli ultimi mesi sono usciti una serie di mmo presi da grossi nomi e licenze come Star wars, D&D, Matrix, ecc.. senza contare i futuri e imminenti arrivi di Lord of the ring, Star Trek
ed Harry Potter.
Il dibattito parte analizzando le ragioni per cui spesso questi grossi nomi portano ad una buona partenza e una buona prevendita ma poi alla fine si riducono ad un mezzo insuccesso e fallimento, basti pensare appunto al buco nell'acqua di Star Wars o alle recenti pesanti critiche a D&D che rischia di partire già con un piede nella fossa.
L'opinione dei dibattenti e che per poter fare un buon mmo basato su una licenza di questo genere bisogna innanzi tutto non commettere 2 errori:Il primo e quello ovviamente di sottovalutare il difficilissimo confronto con i relativi film, infatti è ovvio che riuscire a ricreare l'atmosfera di Star Wars o del Signore degli anelli non è per niente una cosa facile, sia per motivi economici e sia per motivi di tempo, vedi per esempio D&D che pur partendo da una licenza basata su un gioco pare che non sia riuscito a ricompensare i fans per la lunga attesa e per la differenza di gameplay rispetto alla versione cartacea.
Il secondo motivo è ancora più ostico, come tutti sappiamo in un mmo devono poter giocare e interagire migliaia di persone, ma se ognuno di noi vuole interole-playerretare il ruolo dell'eroe o degli eroi del film questo non è possibile, in un gioco single player su Lord of the ring posso essere Ganondorf o Legolas ma in un mmo dovro essere al massimo un elfo qualunque o un nano guerriero, ha quindi senso basare un videogioco su un film se i personaggi dello stesso non possono essere usati e la storia non può essere sviluppata oltre'''
Se ci basiamo su questa considerazione una licenza come Star Trek è molto più adatta del Signore degli anelli perchè i ruoli e i personaggi sono tantissimi e soprattutto la storia non è mai cominciata e non è mai finita, mentre un mmo basato su Harry Potter è già morto prima di nascere.Leggetevi l'articolo e dite la vostra poi io vi dirò la mia
Debate: Should Major IPs (Intellectual Properties) Be Made Into MMORPGs'
This week, News Editor Jon Wood and myself (Lead Content Editor Dana Massey) debate the merits of maching major intellectual properties - such as Lord of the Rings, Harry Potter and Star Trek - into MMORPGs. Jon takes the side that they should not. I argue that they should.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jon Wood: There are a number of flaws in the concept of companies developing MMORPGs based on major pre-existing franchises. I can clearly see why it is done. It creates a pre-made customer base and almost guarantees a strong launch. Unfortunately, from a gamer point of view, these games are doomed to fall short. All you have to do is look at game like 'Star Wars: Galaxies', which has been on the receiving end of a never-ending barrage of criticism because the game doesn't live up to the epic expectations of either Star Wars fans, or MMORPG fans.
What another example' How about the criticism that Turbine has received for their new game, Dungeons and Dragons Online: Stormreach' Players have been waiting for a long time to get their hands on an MMORPG version of their favorite pen and paper game. Now that one is in production, the complaints are coming in about everything from the choice of gaming world (Eberron, which is the newest and least established of the gaming worlds from Wizards of the Coast), to the use of the 3.5 edition rule set. In short, many players are turning away from these games because they do not, and in my opinion, can not, live up to the enormous expectations put uThe Matrix: Path of Neothem by the strength of their individual franchises.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dana Massey: MMORPGs set in large worlds with pre-existing fan bases are a dream from the perspective of investors. There is pretty much a guaranteed return on the dollars put in and let's be honest: that is the point of any responsibly developed game.
However, setting aside the issue of money, I also believe that MMORPGs ' at their root - offer players the chance to live out their day-dreams and escape to another world. Why then should developers be limited to worlds of their own creation when it is places like Middel-Earth and the Star Wars Universe that got them dreaming in the first place'
The difference players and the marketing departments of game companies need to establish is that MMORPGs provide players with the chance to join a famous world, while single-player games offer players the chance to play out the stories of the characters that inspired them.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jon Wood: It's precisely because of that 'famous world' that we run into trouble. The more famous it is, the higher the expectations that players put on it. This leads to the developers having less and less flexibility in the way that their world is built, the rules that they choose to use, and the content that makes the game interesting.
Let's move away from pre-existing titles, and create one of our own. Let's pretend for a moment that someone was maching a Harry Potter MMORPG. Player expectations would be that players go to Hogwarts, probably fight Lord Voldemort and have zany adoveentures. From a game perspective, however, that is extremely limiting. Sure, they could make a world that revolved around the Harry Potter Universe, with many different schools of wizardry existing worldwide, but people, as a whole, would want the things that they were familiar with, not the universe as a whole.--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dana Massey: The core problem with your example is that you picked an IP that has a focused story: Harry Potter himself. There is some universe there, but unlike things like Dungeons & Dragons, Star Wars and the Lord of the Rings, Harry Potter does not have massive amounts of history and lore associated with the world. If Lord of the Rings were the only book Tolchien ever wrote, I would be less enthusiastic.
It is the responsibility of developers to pick IPs that has fans as excited about the worlds as the individual stories; which is to say appropriate worlds for development. Perole-playeretual Entertainment's choice of Star Trek has that potential. That franchise has existed and been popular in a number of incarnations. The only common thread is the universe in which the shows are set. Thus, I believe fans of the series will have no problem with the fact that they cannot be Captain Kirk.
From a developer standpoint, yes they are limited to the scope of their franchise. Is that a problem' No franchise ' not even Lord of the Rings with its encyclopedias of information ' has completely precluded any creativity in terms of adoveenture and story. Largely, these worlds just cut off certain areas. For example, in a Lord of the Rings MMORPG you probably should not have a magic system where everyone is summoning demons. Turbine has found a way around this. These corners that the franchise paints developers into should be seen as an opportunity to do something unique. These are the differences that make sure franchised games cannot be just like every other MMORPG on the market.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jon Wood: First of all, a focused story' Not like Lord of the Rings is a focused story' Moving on. Secondly, the franchise is rare indeed that has a universe that is strong enough to support player interest away from the main focus of the original stories' the protagonists. With pre-existing protagonists running around, players are left to portray secondary bit-players at best. To my understanding, that's not what players want from an MMORPG, players want to feel as though their characters are maching a difference in the gaming world. What you are telling players by putting them into a franchise is that they are secondary, and that their actions will have peripheral effects at best.
In my opinion, even slight alterations to our expectations or internal visualizations of what a gaming world should look like, include, or play like, will destroy the idea that we are playing in a world that we love. Suddenly, we'll find ourselves not looching at the game through the eyes of an MMORPG fan, but rather through the eyes of a jilted fan of whatever the franchise might be
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dana Massey: Basically, you're arguing that we shouldn't make MMORPGs out of popular franchises because it is hard. Obviously, the game is going to visually look and feel like someone else's vision rather than your own, but if the interole-playerreter (the developers) does a good job, this is not an issue. The popularity of the Lord of the Rings trilogy and the Harry Potter movies proves this.
Most major franchises took root with a single focused story. Lord of the Rings has Frodo and his band and Star Trek has the original crew. Yet, the difference between these franchises and things like Harry Potter (although the later may develop this over time as well) is that there is a wealth of other information that people consume. People watch Star Trek because it is Star Trek, not because of Captain Picard. Just as people read about Middel-Earth and its lore, regardelss of Frodo.
As for players being periphery elements of any established world, well this point is moot. Show me one MMORPG where players are the center of attention' Even if they do someday exist, no world's history (not even the encyclopedias of Middel-Earth lore) define a world so tightly that there cannot be original content and adoveentures.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Su Mmorole-playerg.com è apparso un interessante dibattito sullo sviluppo e l'acquisizione di licenze per i giochi di ruolo massivi più diffusi. Se conoscete bene l'inglese si tratta di una discussione molto interessante sui risvolti economici e creativi che coinvolgono gli sviluppatori nel momento in cui pianificano la struttura di un MMORPG basato su un marchio di fama mondiale.
In particolare si parla e si cerca di anallizzare il fenomeno delle licenze, come tutti sappiamo negli ultimi anni e in particolare negli ultimi mesi sono usciti una serie di mmo presi da grossi nomi e licenze come Star wars, D&D, Matrix, ecc.. senza contare i futuri e imminenti arrivi di Lord of the ring, Star Trek
ed Harry Potter.
Il dibattito parte analizzando le ragioni per cui spesso questi grossi nomi portano ad una buona partenza e una buona prevendita ma poi alla fine si riducono ad un mezzo insuccesso e fallimento, basti pensare appunto al buco nell'acqua di Star Wars o alle recenti pesanti critiche a D&D che rischia di partire già con un piede nella fossa.
L'opinione dei dibattenti e che per poter fare un buon mmo basato su una licenza di questo genere bisogna innanzi tutto non commettere 2 errori:
Il primo e quello ovviamente di sottovalutare il difficilissimo confronto con i relativi film, infatti è ovvio che riuscire a ricreare l'atmosfera di Star Wars o del Signore degli anelli non è per niente una cosa facile, sia per motivi economici e sia per motivi di tempo, vedi per esempio D&D che pur partendo da una licenza basata su un gioco pare che non sia riuscito a ricompensare i fans per la lunga attesa e per la differenza di gameplay rispetto alla versione cartacea.
Il secondo motivo è ancora più ostico, come tutti sappiamo in un mmo devono poter giocare e interagire migliaia di persone, ma se ognuno di noi vuole interole-playerretare il ruolo dell'eroe o degli eroi del film questo non è possibile, in un gioco single player su Lord of the ring posso essere Ganondorf o Legolas ma in un mmo dovro essere al massimo un elfo qualunque o un nano guerriero, ha quindi senso basare un videogioco su un film se i personaggi dello stesso non possono essere usati e la storia non può essere sviluppata oltre'''
Se ci basiamo su questa considerazione una licenza come Star Trek è molto più adatta del Signore degli anelli perchè i ruoli e i personaggi sono tantissimi e soprattutto la storia non è mai cominciata e non è mai finita, mentre un mmo basato su Harry Potter è già morto prima di nascere.
Leggetevi l'articolo e dite la vostra poi io vi dirò la mia
Debate: Should Major IPs (Intellectual Properties) Be Made Into MMORPGs'
This week, News Editor Jon Wood and myself (Lead Content Editor Dana Massey) debate the merits of maching major intellectual properties - such as Lord of the Rings, Harry Potter and Star Trek - into MMORPGs. Jon takes the side that they should not. I argue that they should.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jon Wood: There are a number of flaws in the concept of companies developing MMORPGs based on major pre-existing franchises. I can clearly see why it is done. It creates a pre-made customer base and almost guarantees a strong launch. Unfortunately, from a gamer point of view, these games are doomed to fall short. All you have to do is look at game like 'Star Wars: Galaxies', which has been on the receiving end of a never-ending barrage of criticism because the game doesn't live up to the epic expectations of either Star Wars fans, or MMORPG fans.
What another example' How about the criticism that Turbine has received for their new game, Dungeons and Dragons Online: Stormreach' Players have been waiting for a long time to get their hands on an MMORPG version of their favorite pen and paper game. Now that one is in production, the complaints are coming in about everything from the choice of gaming world (Eberron, which is the newest and least established of the gaming worlds from Wizards of the Coast), to the use of the 3.5 edition rule set. In short, many players are turning away from these games because they do not, and in my opinion, can not, live up to the enormous expectations put uThe Matrix: Path of Neothem by the strength of their individual franchises.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dana Massey: MMORPGs set in large worlds with pre-existing fan bases are a dream from the perspective of investors. There is pretty much a guaranteed return on the dollars put in and let's be honest: that is the point of any responsibly developed game.
However, setting aside the issue of money, I also believe that MMORPGs ' at their root - offer players the chance to live out their day-dreams and escape to another world. Why then should developers be limited to worlds of their own creation when it is places like Middel-Earth and the Star Wars Universe that got them dreaming in the first place'
The difference players and the marketing departments of game companies need to establish is that MMORPGs provide players with the chance to join a famous world, while single-player games offer players the chance to play out the stories of the characters that inspired them.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jon Wood: It's precisely because of that 'famous world' that we run into trouble. The more famous it is, the higher the expectations that players put on it. This leads to the developers having less and less flexibility in the way that their world is built, the rules that they choose to use, and the content that makes the game interesting.
Let's move away from pre-existing titles, and create one of our own. Let's pretend for a moment that someone was maching a Harry Potter MMORPG. Player expectations would be that players go to Hogwarts, probably fight Lord Voldemort and have zany adoveentures. From a game perspective, however, that is extremely limiting. Sure, they could make a world that revolved around the Harry Potter Universe, with many different schools of wizardry existing worldwide, but people, as a whole, would want the things that they were familiar with, not the universe as a whole.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dana Massey: The core problem with your example is that you picked an IP that has a focused story: Harry Potter himself. There is some universe there, but unlike things like Dungeons & Dragons, Star Wars and the Lord of the Rings, Harry Potter does not have massive amounts of history and lore associated with the world. If Lord of the Rings were the only book Tolchien ever wrote, I would be less enthusiastic.
It is the responsibility of developers to pick IPs that has fans as excited about the worlds as the individual stories; which is to say appropriate worlds for development. Perole-playeretual Entertainment's choice of Star Trek has that potential. That franchise has existed and been popular in a number of incarnations. The only common thread is the universe in which the shows are set. Thus, I believe fans of the series will have no problem with the fact that they cannot be Captain Kirk.
From a developer standpoint, yes they are limited to the scope of their franchise. Is that a problem' No franchise ' not even Lord of the Rings with its encyclopedias of information ' has completely precluded any creativity in terms of adoveenture and story. Largely, these worlds just cut off certain areas. For example, in a Lord of the Rings MMORPG you probably should not have a magic system where everyone is summoning demons. Turbine has found a way around this. These corners that the franchise paints developers into should be seen as an opportunity to do something unique. These are the differences that make sure franchised games cannot be just like every other MMORPG on the market.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jon Wood: First of all, a focused story' Not like Lord of the Rings is a focused story' Moving on. Secondly, the franchise is rare indeed that has a universe that is strong enough to support player interest away from the main focus of the original stories' the protagonists. With pre-existing protagonists running around, players are left to portray secondary bit-players at best. To my understanding, that's not what players want from an MMORPG, players want to feel as though their characters are maching a difference in the gaming world. What you are telling players by putting them into a franchise is that they are secondary, and that their actions will have peripheral effects at best.
In my opinion, even slight alterations to our expectations or internal visualizations of what a gaming world should look like, include, or play like, will destroy the idea that we are playing in a world that we love. Suddenly, we'll find ourselves not looching at the game through the eyes of an MMORPG fan, but rather through the eyes of a jilted fan of whatever the franchise might be
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dana Massey: Basically, you're arguing that we shouldn't make MMORPGs out of popular franchises because it is hard. Obviously, the game is going to visually look and feel like someone else's vision rather than your own, but if the interole-playerreter (the developers) does a good job, this is not an issue. The popularity of the Lord of the Rings trilogy and the Harry Potter movies proves this.
Most major franchises took root with a single focused story. Lord of the Rings has Frodo and his band and Star Trek has the original crew. Yet, the difference between these franchises and things like Harry Potter (although the later may develop this over time as well) is that there is a wealth of other information that people consume. People watch Star Trek because it is Star Trek, not because of Captain Picard. Just as people read about Middel-Earth and its lore, regardelss of Frodo.
As for players being periphery elements of any established world, well this point is moot. Show me one MMORPG where players are the center of attention' Even if they do someday exist, no world's history (not even the encyclopedias of Middel-Earth lore) define a world so tightly that there cannot be original content and adoveentures.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cita da Hagakure193c su 2 Febbraio 2006, 16:35visto che non mi ha cagato nessuno riprovo con un argomento simile ma con meno parole e + grafica :'
Se volete fare qualche studio sulla diffusione degli mmo e sulle alterne fortune dei vari sottogeneri e dei vari titoli potete trovare delle interessantissime statistiche qui:
Per esempio questo grafico mostra il numero di iscritti attivi fino a metà del 2005 e si vede chiaramente che lineage (linea gialla) è il più attivo di sempre, solo dal 2005 ha iniziato a cedere il passo a lineage2 (linea rossa), tra lo strapotere di lineage si è solo infilato WOW che tra l'altro ha fatto la rampa verticale + veloce di tutti i tempi anche se il valore di oltre 3 milioni di lineage sembra imbattibile.
I valori diThe Matrix Onlinenon sono visibili perchè non sono mai stati dichiarati e verificati ufficialmente ma in ogni caso sarebbero stati poco visibili :(.Da notare inoltre in questo secondo grafico come gli mmo abbiano preso il via nell'ultimo anno modificando drasticamente la rampa media degli anni passati
Date un occhiata al sito ci sono anche nuMerovingiani grafici in base alle categorie al genere ecc.. 😛
visto che non mi ha cagato nessuno riprovo con un argomento simile ma con meno parole e + grafica :'
Se volete fare qualche studio sulla diffusione degli mmo e sulle alterne fortune dei vari sottogeneri e dei vari titoli potete trovare delle interessantissime statistiche qui:
Per esempio questo grafico mostra il numero di iscritti attivi fino a metà del 2005 e si vede chiaramente che lineage (linea gialla) è il più attivo di sempre, solo dal 2005 ha iniziato a cedere il passo a lineage2 (linea rossa), tra lo strapotere di lineage si è solo infilato WOW che tra l'altro ha fatto la rampa verticale + veloce di tutti i tempi anche se il valore di oltre 3 milioni di lineage sembra imbattibile.
I valori diThe Matrix Onlinenon sono visibili perchè non sono mai stati dichiarati e verificati ufficialmente ma in ogni caso sarebbero stati poco visibili :(.
Da notare inoltre in questo secondo grafico come gli mmo abbiano preso il via nell'ultimo anno modificando drasticamente la rampa media degli anni passati
Date un occhiata al sito ci sono anche nuMerovingiani grafici in base alle categorie al genere ecc.. 😛
Cita da Jestas su 2 Febbraio 2006, 21:22cnosco bene questi studi e i mmog in genere e la questione discussa, avrei molto da dire (per l'ennesima volta) ma semplicemente non sono in vena, non è che non l'ho cagato, ma magari fra qualche giorno ^_^
Cmq quei grafici sono relativi perchè la maggior parte delle software house non danno informazione sugli iscritti dei propri servizi online (ricordo con nostalgia i tempi in cui potevo fare "/who all count" in EQ e sapere in ogni momento quanta gente era collegata in tutto il server, eheh.. poi la concorrenza si è fatta fitta, allora c'era solo quello e UO..).
cnosco bene questi studi e i mmog in genere e la questione discussa, avrei molto da dire (per l'ennesima volta) ma semplicemente non sono in vena, non è che non l'ho cagato, ma magari fra qualche giorno ^_^
Cmq quei grafici sono relativi perchè la maggior parte delle software house non danno informazione sugli iscritti dei propri servizi online (ricordo con nostalgia i tempi in cui potevo fare "/who all count" in EQ e sapere in ogni momento quanta gente era collegata in tutto il server, eheh.. poi la concorrenza si è fatta fitta, allora c'era solo quello e UO..).